FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

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V7.1.38 on Ubuntu 11.04

Postby davidcoton » Thu Oct 13, 2011 3:35 pm

My V6 SMP folding on Ubuntu has been suffering download delays recently, so I thought I would try V7. Of course it's documented as not supporting the GPU, so that remains separate (one of the V7 advantages gone before we start :( )

First there is a minor install problem:
Code: Select all
Lintian check results for /home/david/Desktop/fahclient_7.1.38_Ubuntu-10.10-64bit-release_amd64.deb:
E: fahclient: control-file-has-bad-permissions conffiles 0755 != 0644

E: fahclient: control-file-has-bad-permissions templates 0755 != 0644


Then I struck bug #669, but the workaround worked (needed sudo before the command given)

With the local control up, it works fine. But FAHControl is only in Novice mode, and apparently no way to change that?

Of course, FAHControl on Windows can't see FAHClients of Linux64 (Bug #530) so now I need three separate views to monitor folding on 2 PCs. :(

VERDICT: It works, and there is a graphical interface, but the hoped-for integration of SMP and GPU on Windows and Linux is still a dream. :|

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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby 7im » Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:51 pm

New ticket created: https://fah-web.stanford.edu/projects/FAHClient/ticket/745

And check the drop down in the top right corner of fahcontrol, to change novice view.
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Re: V7.1.38 on Ubuntu 11.04

Postby bruce » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:03 pm

davidcoton wrote:VERDICT: It works, and there is a graphical interface, but the hoped-for integration of SMP and GPU on Windows and Linux is still a dream. :|


True, but it's my distinct impression that we're getting closer to that dream -- particularly when (A) V7 is closer than V6 ever could be and (B) there are already open tickets covering the issues you mention and (C) Development is closing important tickets a lot faster than new ones are being created.
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby 7im » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:06 pm

davidcoton wrote:My V6 SMP folding on Ubuntu has been suffering download delays recently, so I thought I would try V7. Of course it's documented as not supporting the GPU, so that remains separate (one of the V7 advantages gone before we start :( )


I'm not sure we can lose an advantage that was not yet stated somewhere. Where did you read that V7 would support GPU clients in Linux upon release?
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby codysluder » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:25 pm

7im wrote:
davidcoton wrote:My V6 SMP folding on Ubuntu has been suffering download delays recently, so I thought I would try V7. Of course it's documented as not supporting the GPU, so that remains separate (one of the V7 advantages gone before we start :( )


I'm not sure we can lose an advantage that was not yet stated somewhere. Where did you read that V7 would support GPU clients in Linux upon release?

I think davidcoton just woke up in a grumpy mood this morning (if it's morning in his timezone). At the present time neither V6 nor V7 support GPUs in Linux. That sort of major development is reserved for some future time after V7 is ready for a public release. They have to fix the bugs discovered in beta first.

At the risk of asking a question that I already know the answer to, when will GPUs be supported in Linux/OS-X? (It's either "soon" or "not soon.")

Seriously, though, has any work been done on developing GPU cores for Linux/OS-X? Have the Linux/OS-X drivers reached a sufficient level of maturity to support FAH?
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby 7im » Thu Oct 13, 2011 5:34 pm

The problems for V7 are the same from v6. The driver model is all over the place, from all the flavors and version revisions of linux, to all the flavors of cards, and the many driver changes for each combo.

If you follow the v6 Wine Wrapper GPU Linux thread, those many challenges are somewhat spelled out.
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby davidcoton » Thu Oct 13, 2011 8:09 pm

Hey, I seem to have stirred something here! I'll try to respond point by point.

My last post should have been a separate thread-- not sure why it's all here.

7im wrote:New ticket created: https://fah-web.stanford.edu/projects/FAHClient/ticket/745

And check the drop down in the top right corner of fahcontrol, to change novice view.

Thanks, 7im, for the ticket. But there isn't a drop-down to change view!! I looked very hard for it. Even tried different glasses, it still wasn't there.

bruce wrote: davidcoton wrote:VERDICT: It works, and there is a graphical interface, but the hoped-for integration of SMP and GPU on Windows and Linux is still a dream. :|

True, but it's my distinct impression that we're getting closer to that dream -- particularly when (A) V7 is closer than V6 ever could be and (B) there are already open tickets covering the issues you mention and (C) Development is closing important tickets a lot faster than new ones are being created.

Agreed absolutely. There is now a good foundation -- it's just the reality of re-coding an existing system that the desired new features (that v6 could not support) will only appear after the new version re-invents the old one. I know, I've been there, done that, got the tee shirt and the battle scars. It doesn't stop me as a user wanting the moon with brass knobs on. It's my contribution to the debate about what we (the users) want, no doubt it will be weighed against other requests and realities.

7im wrote:I'm not sure we can lose an advantage that was not yet stated somewhere. Where did you read that V7 would support GPU clients in Linux upon release?

Clearly V7 is an opportunity to unify SMP and GPU , as has been done in Windows but (for good reasons) not in Linux. That is a lost advantage, even if it was lost in the early planning stage rather than implementation. Even if it was never claimed as a goal of early v7 release. It's something that would make my user experience a lot better, but I'm not in a position to judge the cost and benefit of this feature against the many others that are requested or suggested.

codysluder wrote:I think davidcoton just woke up in a grumpy mood this morning (if it's morning in his timezone).

It wasn't. Don't mistake my brevity for grumpiness. I'm trying to provide honest feedback to help those making decisions about what needs to be done and when to release. I've been both a programmer and a project manager, so I do understand the process. Unfortunately the worthwhile feedback is usually that which asks for more, rather than that which acknowledges the progress made. To redress the balance, in my opinion the current v7 beta is already far preferable to v6, both for Windows and for Linux SMP.

7im wrote:If you follow the v6 Wine Wrapper GPU Linux thread, those many challenges are somewhat spelled out.
.
I know. I'm running Linux Wine GPU, and it was/is painful. Almost made me buy another Windows licence. That's why native Linux GPU support is so desirable.

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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby 7im » Thu Oct 13, 2011 9:09 pm

No Display Mode button? What flavor of linux? Did you use the .deb package install, or the .tgz manual version?
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby jcoffland » Thu Oct 13, 2011 10:37 pm

^w^ing wrote:v7 - 2.40MiB results file took 60 seconds to upload, average transfer rate is about 41 KiB/s
v6 - 2522105 bytes results file took 10 seconds to upload, average transfer rate is, as the client shows, about 246 kB/s

same project, same server (171.64.65.64)

That is the kind of solid evidence we like to see.

v7 does not impose any artificial limits on upload speed. Rate limiting is a requested feature but not yet implemented. There have been other reports of slow long distance uploads in v7. It was discussed quite thourougly here: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=18609 And some very solid evidence was provided here viewtopic.php?f=18&t=18609&start=45#p187024

I made some attempts to resolve the problem but maybe it has not worked. The major difference between v6 and v7 uploading is that v7 uses non-blocking writes which in theory shouldn't be a problem. Another issue may be that v7 is not writing large enough chunks. It's difficult to test because it only seems to happen on distant connections.

EDIT: I've reopened #682
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby jcoffland » Thu Oct 13, 2011 10:37 pm

@davidcoton It's possible, depending on your system font/icon size, that you don't see the mode drop down in the upper right of FAHControl because it has been pushed off the window. Try dragging the FAHControl window larger. If the mode drop down does not show up please post a screen shot.

Regarding GPU support in Linux. The v7 client is ready. We just need a Linux GPU core, which is being worked on but I cannot say how far off that is. As far as I know the Linux drivers exist and work but you might have to install proprietary versions such as the binary only drivers from NVidia. Linux has unfortunately not been our top priority but please complain and complain loudly so that we can justify working on this.
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby davidcoton » Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:05 pm

For 7im and jcoffland...

Ooops, yes, the window was too small. The system boots with small screen res, and I use a remote link -- I'd fixed the screen size but not expanded the window.

Perhaps that's another downside of having as few options as possible in the installer --- maybe the installer needs "advanced" or "expert" options?

As for shouting loudly for features, that's what I'm trying to do ... without wanting to offend anyone or rubbish time and effort spent on other priorities.

Thanks guys,

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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby 7im » Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:41 pm

Eh, thought the rate limiting was already done. The evidence pointed that direction... ;)

Thanks for the updates Joe!!!
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby jcoffland » Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:39 am

@7im Not yet unfortunately. See #91.
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby rhavern » Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:40 am

+1 for Linux and GPU support please.

And v7 is looking good so far, thanks Joe.
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Re: FAHClient V7.1.38 released (4th Open-Beta)

Postby jimerickson » Fri Oct 14, 2011 8:37 am

concur. native linux gpu support please. thanks for all your work jcoffland.
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